Fat for Fuel: The Keto Thread

Discussion in 'Weight Lifting and Nutrition' started by Son of Odin, May 14, 2018.

  1. Michael

    Michael

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    I have this crazy mode of eating sometimes, where eating (especially carbs) makes me hungry. I think it might go back to being a kid, growing up in a larger family. The concept of leftovers. If you don't eat the leftovers, the other vultures will, so you better be hungry or you'll miss your chance altogether.

    Funny thing is if I wait it usually dissipates.
     
  2. OP
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    Son of Odin

    Son of Odin

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    Just had my blood pressure checked. Previously on hypertension range. 5 months of reasonably strict keto and I've downgraded all the way into normal, and not borderline normal either.
     
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  3. Iron

    Iron

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    Good job SoO!

    Man, the more I hear about people cleaning up their diet and the stuff that reverses course, it will take some convincing for me to not believe that 99% of diseases that kill people these days is because of poor diet. I am even about to get on the cancer, if not caused by is at least spurned on by bad food choices train.
     
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  4. Mantis Toboggan

    Mantis Toboggan

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    Doesn't sugar fuel cancer cell growth?
     
  5. OP
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    Son of Odin

    Son of Odin

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    Cancer is caused by a lot of things but metabolic syndrome is one of them. Sugar digestion is the simplest form of energy metabolism on earth, pre dating the Cambrian explosion(makes sense because it doesn't require oxygen(no oxygen pre Cambrian). It's essentially fermentation. This fermentation causes repairable damage to cellular mitochondria. In normal amounts for a human(rarely, small doses, like a forager) this damage is repaired as a normal body function. But when you're super saturating yourself with high carb diet like most of our countrymen, and even what some people call "healthy" low fat diets like bodybuilders, this cellular damage to mitochondrial bodies and mitochondrial DNA builds up and causes the expression of oncogenes, basically super repair genes. These going wildly out of control are typically the cause of cancers, be it from a multitude of sources like toxins, radiation, just plain damage, just being faulty by birth, or the aforementioned metabolic disorder. Not only that, but with people who have existing cancers, ketogenic diets have been shown to help three fold.

    1)starving cancer cells. Because cancer cells can only use two forms of energy. One being sugar and one being an amino acid I can't remember the name of(maybe glucosamine, but only a small percentage can use this) you can starve them out helping stave off additional tumor growth.

    2)because of point 1, tumors have been shown to actually push out towards the exterior of the affected tissues by new, healthy growth and are thusly more susceptible to traditional cut/poison/burn cancer treatments.

    3)reduction of further damage: because the essential inhibitor of fermentation is oxygen, naturally forcing your body to use aerobic respiration to break down fat introduces more oxygen into the cell and inhibits anaerobic respiration.

    This is all in addition to the other beneficial effects. In fact, many endurance athletes like cyclists and distance runners are making the switch because they find they don't hit that "energy wall" during their activity. Has something to do with nutrient transport and efficiency of fuel I think but I don't know enough to comment. To get to this point can take years for your body to reacclimate to proper diet but when it does you become capable of the endurance our early human ancestors were famous for. Prior to the invention of ranged hunting weapons, early humans actually hunted by running their prey down. Sure we're slower, but because we are one of the best mammals evolved for running distances, we can basically take an herbivore which is great at sprinting and run it to exhaustion.
     
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  6. OP
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    Son of Odin

    Son of Odin

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    The funny thing about all of that information is that it was known during the very early stages of cancer research. Some of the observations were made prior to the invention of microscopes that could see at the sub cellular level. In fact, middle class diets during those times were heavily ketogenic too. In fact, if you could ask your great great grandparents what diets to lose weight were in their time they would likely give you something very similar to Atkins
     
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  7. Dek

    Dek

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    One of the biggest downsides about low carbs is the problem of training on low glycogen stores. And, it really sucks balls. But I'm at a point where I can train pretty much every day, keep my strength and stay on low carbs/keto consistently. (~5% net carbs...~10% if you count fiber). My muscles look full and I retain water just fine. I have no planned carb up day, but I do get a carby meal from time to time if I really start aching for some carbs or due to random circumstances. It's crazy how your body eventually learns to spare muscle glycogen when your metabolism fully switches over to fat.

    I'm at 225lbs and my macro breakdown looks something like this. My carbs all come from non starchy plants like nuts, avocados, Kirkland Stir-fry frozen vegetables and shredded cabbage, lol. 3500 calories are maintenance calories at this weight and I feel pretty happy about the whole thing.

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Endymion

    Endymion

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    I can definitely confirm that I personally tend to have out of control, heroin like cravings from non-ketogenic intermittent fasting.

    It worked for maybe two months, tops. I would have a cup of butter coffee in the morning and nothing until dinner, then dinner would be like a cup of rice etc with whatever else I wanted. Eventually though I just started wanting more and more carbs for dinner, and finally I wasn't able to control myself during the day.

    I'm talking cravings to the point where I can't think about anything else, and even got fucking light headed/trembly at points. Now what's weird about that is that I didn't really gain significantly more weight after I had successfully dropped down 15 or so, but I didn't drop any more either.

    This would tend to confirm your statement about metabolic issues and pre-diabetes basically from doing IF and having carbs in the evening, not sure if you talked about it in this thread.


    Frankly I think the only way I'm going to get to my optimal weight (want to lose another 20 pounds at least) is keto at this point. I just hit 30, am physically active but not enough to lose weight naturally, and was fat as a kid which is all working against me.

    The massive other health benefits you're discussing intrigue me greatly, I would like to be very healthy for the next 30 years given I have another kid on the way and I'll probably be working a trade job or something the whole time. I need MAXIMUM energy, want to shitpost, raise kids, work 40 hours + a week and so forth and it's gonna take a lot!
     
  9. Endymion

    Endymion

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    I'm 235 now, trying to drop to say 200. If I want to do that in 4 months, let's call it 2000 calories to start, I can adjust exercise and diet as my body adapts.

    Y'all wanna help me make a grocery shopping and recipe list? Unfortunately not a huge fan of ground beef but I love pork products, whole chickens (breasts go to the wife usually) and stew beef.
     
  10. OP
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    Son of Odin

    Son of Odin

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    We can talk in discord tonight after I get home in an hour or so. Can also give recommendations for places if you're out
     
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  11. Motivationman

    Motivationman Moderator

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    Overeat for 3 days (like an entire slow cooked pork butt a day) which will dull cravings for other foods. Basically any meat dish from a crock pot or slow cooker will be fine. Chili is my go to but there are plenty of other options. Pork butt, pot roast, chicken thighs (I consider that the goat chicken part). Very easy, just season and stick in the cooker (or in the case of the chicken put seasoning salt and bake in oven). After your 3 days you're going to need to adjust calories. Weigh yourself every day first thing in the morning and maintain a consistent level of physical activity. If your weight stops going down calories will have to come down. Once you are used to keto you'll find you don't really get hungry anymore so calorie restriction won't be a psychological hurdle as it is with people who are constantly spiking their blood sugar and triggering their body's hunger response.
     
  12. Motivationman

    Motivationman Moderator

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    Don't worry about counting calories. Just eat the same thing every day and adjust your diet based on whether weight is coming down or not. You have no idea if 2000 calories is a deficit for you or not. Every body is different.
     
  13. OP
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    Son of Odin

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    I definitely notice a decreased hunger level during the day.
     
  14. MrSaltyAndMeaty

    MrSaltyAndMeaty

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    If I get super hungry I eat stuff that I know is good for me but I don't like much, like a whole bunch of sardines.